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Author Topic: Course Revisions  (Read 1451 times)

Helge Klåre Fauskanger

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Course Revisions
« on: September 25, 2011, 05:00:00 PM »

I have uploaded a rough version of my revised Quenya course here:

http://Http://folk.uib.no/hnohf/lessons.rtf

There is still no link from the Ardalambion main page, but people can at
least see for themselves that this LONG-announced revision actually
exists. Some typographical peculiarities need to be sorted out; in
particular, the font size mysteriously changes halfway through the
document. Some artifact of the uploading process, I think.

The revised Appendices are not included in this file, but I will add
them.

I think about turning the whole thing into a pdf file, so that I can be
sure it comes out the way it is supposed to, on people's screens. (In
one browser I used to look at it, huge sections mysteriously appeared in
all-capitals.)

Any ideas are welcome. What I would really do is to write a wholly new
Quenya course, but this version at least includes patches that take care
of some of the most desperate problems. (Remember, folks, the past tense
'lay' is _caine_! Not _caitane_! Never, never use _caitane_!  If you
seem to remember me saying anything different, forget it!)

- Hkf



[elfling ID#36115]
[original subject: Course Revisions]
« Last Edit: September 25, 2011, 05:00:00 PM by Helge Klåre Fauskanger »
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Andrew Higgins

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« Reply #1 on: September 25, 2011, 05:00:00 PM »

Helge

This is brilliant your work in the past has been very helpful and will
eagerly read this through and give you any comments.  Working on Finnish
at the moment so it will be interesting to do together!

Best Andy

Sent from the ipad of Andrew Higgins Andrew Higgins  Andrew Higgins on
Twitter And at his blog Wotan's Musings
http://wotanselvishmusings.blogspot.com/


On 26 Sep 2011, at 18:59, Helge Klåre Fauskanger wrote:

> I have uploaded a rough version of my revised Quenya course here:
>
> http://Http://folk.uib.no/hnohf/lessons.rtf
>
> There is still no link from the Ardalambion main page, but people can
> at least see for themselves that this LONG-announced revision actually
> exists. Some typographical peculiarities need to be sorted out; in
> particular, the font size mysteriously changes halfway through the
> document. Some artifact of the uploading process, I think.
>
> The revised Appendices are not included in this file, but I will
> add them.
>
> I think about turning the whole thing into a pdf file, so that I can
> be sure it comes out the way it is supposed to, on people's screens.
> (In one browser I used to look at it, huge sections mysteriously
> appeared in all-capitals.)
>
> Any ideas are welcome. What I would really do is to write a wholly new
> Quenya course, but this version at least includes patches that take
> care of some of the most desperate problems. (Remember, folks, the
> past tense 'lay' is _caine_! Not _caitane_! Never, never use
> _caitane_! If you seem to remember me saying anything different,
> forget it!)
>
> - Hkf
>
>






[elfling ID#36116]
[original subject: Course Revisions]
« Last Edit: September 25, 2011, 05:00:00 PM by Andrew Higgins »
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Ramaroreo

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« Reply #2 on: September 25, 2011, 05:00:00 PM »

Thank you, Helge, for this revised course. I look forward to reading it.

> Some typographical peculiarities need to be sorted out; in particular,
> the font size mysteriously changes halfway through the document. Some
> artifact of the uploading process, I think.
>

> I think about turning the whole thing into a pdf file, so that I can
> be sure it comes out the way it is supposed to, on people's screens.
> (In one browser I used to look at it, huge sections mysteriously
> appeared in all-capitals.)
>

The font size and the capitals can easily be corrected by everyone:
- Save the file in word
- The select the whole text
- Under fonts one has to tick off the 'small capitals'
- Chose Times New Roman 12
- Save the changes


And the whole text is perfect.

óRerámar



[elfling ID#36117]
[original subject: Course Revisions]
« Last Edit: September 25, 2011, 05:00:00 PM by Ramaroreo »
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Pavel Dimov

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« Reply #3 on: September 26, 2011, 05:00:00 PM »

Thank you very much!

Harya alasse!
---
Ammornil Henduluin


Helge Klåre Fauskanger < Helge Klåre Fauskanger> wrote:

> **
>
>
> I have uploaded a rough version of my revised Quenya course here:
>
> http://Http://folk.uib.no/hnohf/lessons.rtf
>
> There is still no link from the Ardalambion main page, but people can
> at least see for themselves that this LONG-announced revision actually
> exists. Some typographical peculiarities need to be sorted out; in
> particular, the font size mysteriously changes halfway through the
> document. Some artifact of the uploading process, I think.
>
> The revised Appendices are not included in this file, but I will
> add them.
>
> I think about turning the whole thing into a pdf file, so that I can
> be sure it comes out the way it is supposed to, on people's screens.
> (In one browser I used to look at it, huge sections mysteriously
> appeared in all-capitals.)
>
> Any ideas are welcome. What I would really do is to write a wholly new
> Quenya course, but this version at least includes patches that take
> care of some of the most desperate problems. (Remember, folks, the
> past tense 'lay' is _caine_! Not _caitane_! Never, never use
> _caitane_! If you seem to remember me saying anything different,
> forget it!)
>
> - Hkf
>
>






[elfling ID#36118]
[original subject: Course Revisions]
« Last Edit: September 26, 2011, 05:00:00 PM by Pavel Dimov »
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Yvonne Van Brimmer

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« Reply #4 on: September 27, 2011, 05:00:00 PM »

Thank you for the update on the Quenya course. Most appreciated! Yvonne


Yvonne Van Brimmer aka.Tamurile Halfelven 'Nai Laivin caluva tielyanna!'



[elfling ID#36120]
[original subject: Course Revisions]
« Last Edit: September 27, 2011, 05:00:00 PM by Yvonne Van Brimmer »
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César Rojas

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« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2011, 05:00:00 PM »

 I plan to take the course during university holidays, but now i'll
 take the revised one then.

Much appreciated,

César





[elfling ID#36121]
[original subject: Course Revisions]
« Last Edit: September 28, 2011, 05:00:00 PM by César Rojas »
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Fra Veneziano

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« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2011, 05:00:00 PM »

Thanks, I'll read it carefully in the next days. A pdf version would be
greatly appreciated for portability and consistence. I have a doubt
about the use of _lá_ and/or _epë_ for comparatives (I opened a
different thread for that), and I spotted a minor typo in the first note
in lesson eighteen (simular-> similar)

Helge Klåre Fauskanger wrote:
>
> I have uploaded a rough version of my revised Quenya course here:
>
> http://Http://folk.uib.no/hnohf/lessons.rtf
>
> There is still no link from the Ardalambion main page, but people can
> at least see for themselves that this LONG-announced revision actually
> exists. Some typographical peculiarities need to be sorted out; in
> particular, the font size mysteriously changes halfway through the
> document. Some artifact of the uploading process, I think.
>
> The revised Appendices are not included in this file, but I will
> add them.
>
> I think about turning the whole thing into a pdf file, so that I can
> be sure it comes out the way it is supposed to, on people's screens.
> (In one browser I used to look at it, huge sections mysteriously
> appeared in all-capitals.)
>
> Any ideas are welcome. What I would really do is to write a wholly new
> Quenya course, but this version at least includes patches that take
> care of some of the most desperate problems. (Remember, folks, the
> past tense 'lay' is _caine_! Not _caitane_! Never, never use
> _caitane_!  If you seem to remember me saying anything different,
> forget it!)
>
> - Hkf
>



[elfling ID#36123]
[original subject: Course Revisions]
« Last Edit: September 28, 2011, 05:00:00 PM by Fra Veneziano »
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Yitzik

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« Reply #7 on: October 03, 2011, 05:00:00 PM »

 M·riessÎ, a moinî nildonyar!

Helge Klåre Fauskanger wrote:
>
> I have uploaded a rough version of my revised Quenya course here:
>
> http://Http://folk.uib.no/hnohf/lessons.rtf

First of all, I'd like to express my sincere gratitude to Helge for his
excellent course. It was my starting point in studying Quenya, after
all. You're doing a great job, man. That is why the revision of the qc
in light of new data (esp. From pe17 and vt49) is of great help for us,
learners. Still I wonder a bit about Lesson 8 with the negative verb.
The course still offers 'umin + Infinitive' construction, though I see
you using the fresher version 'uan + tense form' in your Johannine
translation, too. Would the latter be worth mention in the Course, too?

Friendly yours, Isaac Kiev, Ukraine



[elfling ID#36126]
[original subject: Course Revisions]
« Last Edit: October 03, 2011, 05:00:00 PM by Yitzik »
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Fra Veneziano

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« Reply #8 on: October 06, 2011, 05:00:00 PM »

In Lesson 13, at the end of the section 'The pronoun we', it says
'whereas -mmë (formerly exclusive plural) ended up as dual inclusive
“we”, with either -ngwë or -nquë as the corresponding dual
inclusive form.' Which clearly contains a typo. -Mmë ended up as dual
*exclusive* we, judging from what is said in other parts of the same
Lesson, didn't it?

PSI think I make a favour to the author and the future readers in
  pointing out these small corrections; I do not mean to nitpick.



[elfling ID#36129]
[original subject: Course Revisions]
« Last Edit: October 06, 2011, 05:00:00 PM by Fra Veneziano »
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Paul Strack

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« Reply #9 on: October 08, 2011, 05:00:00 PM »

 I'd also like to thank you for producing your Quenya course, which was
 my re-introduction to Tolkien's languages after many years of absence.

For formatting, I looked at the rtf file, and it seems that its picked
up a lot of detritus over the years (miscellaneous font size changes and
so forth). In most word processors, it is difficult to clean up the
text, because it is hard to get the program to remove some styles but
not others.

When I've faced this issue myself, I convert the text to html, clean up
the html and convert back to a word processor document. I did this when
I first read your previous course, and did a quick experiment this
morning with the draft of the new version.

I could preserve almost all of the 'meaningful' formatting: section
headers, colors, bold, italics and underlines. I am having trouble with
the blockquotes, but I haven't put much effort into figuring it out.

If you'd like, I could email you the cleaned up files (both html and
rtf). It didn't take me long. If you like the result, I'd be happy to
do similar cleaning on any later drafts you have, since presumably
you've made some edits in the last couple weeks.



[elfling ID#36130]
[original subject: Course Revisions]
« Last Edit: October 08, 2011, 05:00:00 PM by Paul Strack »
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Helge Klåre Fauskanger

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« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2011, 05:00:00 PM »

 Thanks for various comments!


One generous offer I noted:

> I'd also like to thank you for producing your Quenya course, which
Was my re-introduction to Tolkien's languages after many years of
absence. (...) If you'd like, I could email you the cleaned up files
(both html and rtf). It didn't take me long. If you like the result,
I'd be happy to do similar cleaning on any later drafts you have, since
presumably you've made some edits in the last couple weeks.

Actually not; I have been busy with another project. That is also why I
may have seemed a little bit unresponsive in this forum (please don't
think I am in any way insulted if people produce constructive critique
of my work!). I shall be happy to receive the rtf file.

To all of you: You don't have to make any excuses about 'nitpicking'
if you find errors. This is a fairly complex document, and when I make
changes in one place that often leaves inconsistencies and incomplete
revisions in other places. I very much appreciate any help I can get in
weeding out the imperfections.

One thing that was pointed out: No, I didn't introduce the 'new'
negative verb _ua_ in the main text, for I don't consider the _um-_
forms from the Etymologies necessarily obsolete, but I will mention the
'new' negative verb in an appendix (already written).

- Hkf



[elfling ID#36140]
[original subject: Rel Course Revisions]
« Last Edit: October 23, 2011, 05:00:00 PM by Helge Klåre Fauskanger »
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Helge Klåre Fauskanger

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« Reply #11 on: October 17, 2011, 05:00:00 PM »

Paul Strack wrote:


> I'd also like to thank you for producing your Quenya course, which
Was my re-introduction to Tolkien's languages after many years of
absence. (...) If you'd like, I could email you the cleaned up files
(both html and rtf). It didn't take me long. If you like the result,
I'd be happy to do similar cleaning on any later drafts you have, since
presumably you've made some edits in the last couple weeks.

Actually not; I have been busy with another project. That is also why I
may have seemed a little bit unresponsive in this forum (please don't
think I am in any way insulted if people produce constructive critique
of my work!). I shall be happy to receive the rtf file.

To all of you: You don't have to make any excuses about 'nitpicking'
if you find errors. This is a fairly complex document, and when I make
changes in one place that often leaves inconsistencies and incomplete
revisions in other places. I very much appreciate any help I can get in
weeding out the imperfections.

One thing that was pointed out: No, I didn't introduce the 'new'
negative verb _ua_ in the main text, for I don't consider the _um-_
forms from the Etymologies necessarily obsolete, but I will mention the
'new' negative verb in an appendix (already written).

- Hkf



[elfling ID#36141]
[original subject: Course Revisions]
« Last Edit: October 17, 2011, 05:00:00 PM by Helge Klåre Fauskanger »
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Rodrigo Jaroszewski

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« Reply #12 on: November 09, 2011, 05:00:00 PM »

 Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the epub format just a collection
 of html files inside a container? In that case, your work could be used
 to create an epub version, which would be readable in many portable
 devices (like iPhones and iPads). Conversion to mobi (Kindle) should be
 fairly easy from there too.

Rodrigo Jaroszewski


Paul Strack wrote:

>
> I'd also like to thank you for producing your Quenya course, which
> was my re-introduction to Tolkien's languages after many years of
> absence.
>
> For formatting, I looked at the rtf file, and it seems that its picked
> up a lot of detritus over the years (miscellaneous font size changes
> and so forth). In most word processors, it is difficult to clean up
> the text, because it is hard to get the program to remove some styles
> but not others.
>
> When I've faced this issue myself, I convert the text to html, clean
> up the html and convert back to a word processor document. I did this
> when I first read your previous course, and did a quick experiment
> this morning with the draft of the new version.
>
> I could preserve almost all of the 'meaningful' formatting:
> section headers, colors, bold, italics and underlines. I am having
> trouble with the blockquotes, but I haven't put much effort into
> figuring it out.
>
> If you'd like, I could email you the cleaned up files (both html and
> rtf). It didn't take me long. If you like the result, I'd be happy
> to do similar cleaning on any later drafts you have, since presumably
> you've made some edits in the last couple weeks.






[elfling ID#36149]
[original subject: Course Revisions]
« Last Edit: November 09, 2011, 05:00:00 PM by Rodrigo Jaroszewski »
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Mikki

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« Reply #13 on: January 22, 2012, 05:00:00 PM »

 Hello! I too would like to thank you for making this course. I came
 across it years ago and enjoyed it then and have enjoyed going back
 through this revised edition.

I'm only up through lesson 9 but I've come across a few things that I
believe need fixing. I'm copying the text in from Word, so I hope it
displays correctly. If you'd rather I email any more I come across,
please let me know.

Lesson 6, Exercise 2
M. A man wrote five books. Key: Nér tencë lempë parmar. Should be: Nér
   tencë parmar lempë. (Numbers two and greater follow the nouns)

Lesson 6, Exercise 2
N. The queen rose and lifted up a treasure. Key: I tári orontë. Should
   be: I tári orontë ar ortanë harma. (Second half of sentence seems to
   be missing)

Lesson 9, Exercise 1
O. Sílala Isil ortanë or Ambar. Key: [The] shining moon is rising over
   the world. Should be: [The] shining moon rose over the world. Or
   sentence should be: Sílala Isil ortëa or Ambar. (Ortanë = rose; ortëa
   = is rising)

Lesson 9, Exercise 1
P. Minë nér túrala minë macil úva ruhta I tolto taurë ohtari. Should be:
   Er nér túrala er macil úva ruhta I taurë ohtari tolto. (Minë = first
   in series; Er = number one; Numbers two and greater follow the nouns)

Lesson 9, Exercise 1
Q. I tolto rávi caitala nu I aldar ortaner, an I rávi merner matë I
   neri. Should be: I rávi tolto caitala nu I aldar ortaner, an I rávi
   merner matë I neri. (Numbers two and greater follow the nouns)

Lesson 9, Exercise 2
R. The eight traveling Dwarves can find many treasures. Key: I tolto
   lelyala Naucor polir hirë rimbë harmar. Should be: I lelyala
   Naucor tolto polir hire rimbë harmar. (Numbers two and greater
   follow the nouns)

If I am incorrect in any of this, please let me know!

~Mikki


Helge Klåre Fauskanger wrote:
>
> I have uploaded a rough version of my revised Quenya course here:
>
> http://Http://folk.uib.no/hnohf/lessons.rtf
>
> There is still no link from the Ardalambion main page, but people can
> at least see for themselves that this LONG-announced revision actually
> exists. Some typographical peculiarities need to be sorted out; in
> particular, the font size mysteriously changes halfway through the
> document. Some artifact of the uploading process, I think.
>
> The revised Appendices are not included in this file, but I will
> add them.
>
> I think about turning the whole thing into a pdf file, so that I can
> be sure it comes out the way it is supposed to, on people's screens.
> (In one browser I used to look at it, huge sections mysteriously
> appeared in all-capitals.)
>
> Any ideas are welcome. What I would really do is to write a wholly new
> Quenya course, but this version at least includes patches that take
> care of some of the most desperate problems. (Remember, folks, the
> past tense 'lay' is _caine_! Not _caitane_! Never, never use
> _caitane_!  If you seem to remember me saying anything different,
> forget it!)
>
> - Hkf
>



[elfling ID#36220]
[original subject: Course Revisions]
« Last Edit: January 22, 2012, 05:00:00 PM by Mikki »
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