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Author Topic: Aurinko & Aure, Sun and Day  (Read 918 times)

Petri Tikka

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Aurinko & Aure, Sun and Day
« on: November 15, 2007, 05:00:00 PM »

Q(u)Enya _aure_ 'sunlight, sunshine, gold light, warmth' (pe12:33)
    with its later glosses (such as 'day(light)', rc:727) is
    suspiciously similar to Finnish _aurinko_ 'the sun'. I just
    realized this while reading the commentary on this word in vt49:45.
    It's strange that I couldn't find anybody noticing this obvious
    dependency before me. The Finnish word _aurinko_ possibly decends
    from _auer_ 'haze'. And a diminutive form of Quenya _aure_ would
    be _*aurinke_...

Aure entuluva! ;)

Petri Samuel Tikka www.geocities.com/petristikka/elvish/



[elfling ID#34549]
[original subject: Aurinko & Aure, Sun and Day]
« Last Edit: November 15, 2007, 05:00:00 PM by Petri Tikka »
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Petri Tikka

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Aurinko & Aure, Sun and Day
« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2007, 05:00:00 PM »

Carl Hostetter just informed me that the similarity between q _aure_
and f _aurinko_ has been noted before, namely in vt33:23 by Christopher
Gilson (January 1994). I don't own that issue of vt, so I didn't
know. But according to my searches, it hasn't been observed online
before (E.G. in any of the mailing lists). Nor afaik in any of the
VT's I own. ;)

- Petri

'Petri Tikka wrote:
>
> Q(u)Enya _aure_ 'sunlight, sunshine, gold light, warmth' (pe12:33)
>     with its later glosses (such as 'day(light)', rc:727) is
>     suspiciously similar to Finnish _aurinko_ 'the sun'. I just
>     realized this while reading the commentary on this word in
>     vt49:45. It's strange that I couldn't find anybody noticing this
>     obvious dependency before me. The Finnish word _aurinko_ possibly
>     decends from _auer_ 'haze'. And a diminutive form of Quenya
>     _aure_ would be _*aurinke_...



[elfling ID#34550]
[original subject: Aurinko & Aure, Sun and Day]
« Last Edit: November 15, 2007, 05:00:00 PM by Petri Tikka »
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Traverse Travis

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Aurinko & Aure, Sun and Day
« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2007, 05:00:00 PM »

Petri Tikka wrote:
>
> Q(u)Enya _aure_ 'sunlight, sunshine, gold light, warmth' (pe12:33)
>     with its later glosses (such as 'day(light)', rc:727) is
>     suspiciously similar to Finnish _aurinko_ 'the sun'. I just
>     realized this while reading the commentary on this word in
>     vt49:45. It's strange that I couldn't find anybody noticing this
>     obvious dependency before me. The Finnish word _aurinko_ possibly
>     decends from _auer_ 'haze'. And a diminutive form of Quenya
>     _aure_ would be _*aurinke_...

Hmm! That makes sense.

A second Primary World influence is likely Latin  'gold' and its
Proto-Indo-European ancestor *  'to shine; gold' and its
derivative *  'dawn, sunrise, east'. There's a whole bunch of
descendants, including Latin  ('daybreak') and
('southern'), and English .

(Reference: http://starling.rinet.ru/cgi-bin/etymology.cgi?
Single=1&basename=/data/ie/piet&text_number=++21&root=config )

As the paramount flavors for Quenya, it's fitting that Finnish and
Latin were the likely inspirations for that word.

Travis



[elfling ID#34552]
[original subject: Aurinko & Aure, Sun and Day]
« Last Edit: November 15, 2007, 05:00:00 PM by Traverse Travis »
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Benct Philip Jonsson

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Aurinko & Aure, Sun and Day
« Reply #3 on: November 16, 2007, 05:00:00 PM »

On 2007-11-16 Petri Tikka wrote:
> Q(u)Enya _aure_ 'sunlight, sunshine, gold light, warmth' (pe12:33)
>     with its later glosses (such as 'day(light)', rc:727) is
>     suspiciously similar to Finnish _aurinko_ 'the sun'. I just
>     realized this while reading the commentary on this word in
>     vt49:45. It's strange that I couldn't find anybody noticing this
>     obvious dependency before me. The Finnish word _aurinko_ possibly
>     decends from _auer_ 'haze'. And a diminutive form of Quenya
>     _aure_ would be _*aurinke_...
>
> Aure entuluva! ;)
>
> Petri Samuel Tikka

I have thought of the possible adjective _aurinque_ 'full of
daylight'.


/Bp
--
Benct Philip Jonsson -- melroch atte melroch dotte se
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~__
               

'I am not altogether on anybody's side, because nobody
is altogether on my side'                   -- Fangorn



[elfling ID#34554]
[original subject: Aurinko & Aure, Sun and Day]
« Last Edit: November 16, 2007, 05:00:00 PM by Benct Philip Jonsson »
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Christopher Gilson

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Aurinko & Aure, Sun and Day
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2007, 05:00:00 PM »

This was also mentioned by Petri when we were discussing Finnish and the
Qenya lexicon, back in September 2003, on the Lambengolmor list.  Here
is the url to his message:
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/lambengolmor/message/485

There were a lot of interesting connections pointed out in that thread.

- Christopher


'Petri Tikka wrote:
>
> Carl Hostetter just informed me that the similarity between q _aure_
> and f _aurinko_ has been noted before, namely in vt33:23 by
> Christopher Gilson (January 1994). I don't own that issue of vt, so I
> didn't know. But according to my searches, it hasn't been observed
> online before (E.G. in any of the mailing lists). Nor afaik in any of
> the VT's I own. ;)
>
> - Petri
>
> 'Petri Tikka' wrote:
> >
> > Q(u)Enya _aure_ 'sunlight, sunshine, gold light, warmth' (pe12:33)
> >     with its later glosses (such as 'day(light)', rc:727) is
> >     suspiciously similar to Finnish _aurinko_ 'the sun'. I just
> >     realized this while reading the commentary on this word in
> >     vt49:45. It's strange that I couldn't find anybody noticing
> >     this obvious dependency before me. The Finnish word _aurinko_
> >     possibly decends from _auer_ 'haze'. And a diminutive form of
> >     Quenya _aure_ would be _*aurinke_...
>



[elfling ID#34559]
[original subject: Aurinko & Aure, Sun and Day]
« Last Edit: November 17, 2007, 05:00:00 PM by Christopher Gilson »
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Petri Tikka

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Aurinko & Aure, Sun and Day
« Reply #5 on: November 18, 2007, 05:00:00 PM »

Well, indeed. My memory is not serving me very well. Should not trust
search engines or Tolklang search that much anymore. ;)

- Petri

'Christopher Gilson wrote:
>
> This was also mentioned by Petri when we were discussing Finnish and
> the Qenya lexicon, back in September 2003, on the Lambengolmor list.
> Here is the url to his message:
> http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/lambengolmor/message/485
>
> There were a lot of interesting connections pointed out in that
> thread.



[elfling ID#34563]
[original subject: Aurinko & Aure, Sun and Day]
« Last Edit: November 18, 2007, 05:00:00 PM by Petri Tikka »
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